PLG Pro - Filtering

[dave-t]

On a sunday afternoon I play only tracks that have reached No 1 in the charts

All my No 1's are contained in their own file structure and have a dedicated database.

Each file is tagged - in the comment field - with 19x0s, One or 19x0s, Xmas to indicate if it is a Christmas themed No 1.

My filter in PLG Pro selects the decade and "One" (and will add "Xmas" at the apprpriate time of the year)

Therefore it read something like 1980s, One

However this afternoon it selected 2 Christmas (Xmas) tagged files and I cannot understand why.

I have checked both the database and the and the pre-set and are both correct. I have also checked both files which have in their tags "1980s, Xmas" AND I have doubled checked that they are written in ID3V2.4

I cannot understand why the preset is set for "1980s, One" and it is still selecting files tagged as "1980s Xmas"

Any ideas?

 

[djsoft]

If you're selecting tracks using "1980s" filter - it will include all tracks which have "1980s" in their comment (no matter what other strings are there in the comment). Therefore tracks with "1980s, Xmas" comment will be selected.

If you don't need Xmas tracks, include "NOT Xmas" in the filter, eg. "1980s, NOT Xmas".

If you need tracks which have both "1980s" and "One" in the comment, the filter should be like this:
"REQUIRE 1980s, REQUIRE One, NOT Xmas"

 

[dave-t]

Aha! now I understand 

Syntax error = rubbish playlist !!

Thanks

 

[radiodungog]

dave-t,

What a great idea !  I have recently started to tag tracks in the "Comment" field so that we can generate music programes that are suited to different times of the day and night.

My thoughts were to use a combination of tags something like this:
Top-40 = top-40 chart
AC = adult contemporary chart
date = date it hit the chart (not sure of what date format to use)
#1, #2, #3 = top position reached in chart
8w, 12w, 16w = number of weeks in chart
all, none, breaky, morn, arvo, night, overnight = optional tag for time of day suitability

Am I heading in the right direction with the info above ?  Suggestions ?

From there we would batch a series of master playlists to work from.  It would be good if we could push a magic button and reindex the lot - but I don't think that is possible.

Then if our thoughts change as to whether a track is more or less suitable for a time slot or whatever we will go back to the "Comment" field and change it accordingly.  For example, if an experienced presenter considers a particular track to be too heavy for us to play at all we would leave all the tags alone in the "Comment" field but delete the last bit with the suitable time of day part - or select the "none" option.

This sounds like a lot of work - and it is - but Rome wasn't built in a day and if we start to put in the hard yards now it will get easier in the long term.

In rough number terms the Top-40 charts over 54 years has about 10,000 different tracks.  The Adult Contemporary charts over 45 years has about 8,000 different tracks.  Our music library is nowhere near that extensive

dave-t, what is the rest of your "Comment" field tagging structure ?


This is exciting stuff,  Jamie C.

 

[radiodungog]

dave-t,

We use a Vortexbox to store our music files and store them in artist folders, album folders and then the music tracks.  We do not create new folders for specialised music selections but instead use playlists in RadioBOSS to do all of that.

However, there is a very neat feature in Vortexbox that does a lot of track categorisation - and it does it automatically according to the music track meta-tags.  It's called Squeezebox Server and it has a web based page view of the entire library and only shows categories that are present in your music library files.

For example, in the date view it will only show year dates of the tracks you have.  So you might see something like this:
1960
1961
1962
1965
1966
1967
1970

and years are not displayed if you don't have them.

Same with artist, album, genre.  It would be VERY interesting to have the "Comment" filed included in this page view so you could get a statistical display of your library in "Comment" field terms.

And when you do some meta-tag editing and you want the screen updated to reflect the changes you just made there is a reprocess button that does that.  I tried it with 300 albums containing 4,500 tracks and it took about a minute to reindex.


Jamie C.

 

[dave-t]

Hi Jamie

Firstly, thanks for pointing me in the direction of Vortex Box. an interesting piece of kit that I will investigate at some point in the near future. I like the fact that you can download the software for free and build your own box ! 

MY "master music library" is actually based on iTunes and stand outside of RB. It stores the files in an artist/album structure. This "master library" acts as the "source" for my RB music library. any music files I want to be included in my RB music library are simply copied to RB.

One of the reasons I chose RB was I preferred the way that you database your files which would be a lot easier to rebuild if something goes wrong. I also like the fact that you can create multiple databases as this allows me to create a database for specific shows/genres/eras. coupling this with the directory structure and PLGPro makes it easy for me to create a show, automatically, that is both flexible yet specific in the way I want it to sound.

IT IS VITAL that, if you are going to use the comments field, and others, you need to ensure that the tags are correctly written.

there are several different TAG versions and you HAVE to get this right. different software vendors/ripping systems use different versions which could cause you problems.

RB uses ID3V2.4 so I would recommend stripping all other tags and writing in this version. Mp3Tag is a great free mass tag editor which will do this for you, if properly configured and will greatly speed up the tagging process. As I have specific directory structures I can Tag and re-tag an entire directory very quickly.

It is also worth noting that RB V4.9 or 5.0 is planned to allow you to use more of the tags within PLG Pro including the Genre field and possibly others. Dmitry will be able to clarify this point.

IF RB/PLGPro is going to use the Genre field in the near future then consider using this and use the Comments field to allow you to be more specific. PLGPro already uses the DATE field BUT ensure that the tag is correctly written.

What you put in your comments field is entirely up to you.

I use

19X0s - to denote the decade
Xmas - to tag a file as a Christmas Specific song
Chart - to denote that it was in the charts
One - to denote it was a No 1

with an associated database you can very easily generate a playlist with a perfect mix of say 1980s No 1's or even generate a playlist with X No of tracks of No 1's for a specific year

I think you already have some good ideas as to other phrases you could use - it all depends on what you want a specific show to sound like !

I have created directory structures based on specific shows and, generally, my databases are based on that specific directory structure. It works for me but possibly not for others. Yes I have duplicates but hard disks are cheap enough to allow this !

RB/PLGPro are very flexible and thus powerful. they can be used in many different ways depending on need to create a playlist of what ever you want! that is why I love RB

 

[radiodungog]

Dave,

Thanks for the reply and suggestion for some simple to understand tags.  I downloaded MP3tag two weeks ago and yes it is a powerful tagging solution.  I'll tag a few dozen tracks and have play with RB to see the results.

And I like RB because it's a good product with excellent support.

Thanks, Jamie C.

 

[dave-t]

Dave,

Thanks for the reply and suggestion for some simple to understand tags.  I downloaded MP3tag two weeks ago and yes it is a powerful tagging solution.  I'll tag a few dozen tracks and have play with RB to see the results.

And I like RB because it's a good product with excellent support.

Thanks, Jamie C.

MOST CERTAINLY 

 

[djsoft]

IT IS VITAL that, if you are going to use the comments field, and others, you need to ensure that the tags are correctly written.

there are several different TAG versions and you HAVE to get this right. different software vendors/ripping systems use different versions which could cause you problems.

RB uses ID3V2.4 so I would recommend stripping all other tags and writing in this version.

A bit of offtopic: it won't be necessary to use specific tag version after RB 4.9 release. Tagging was completely reworked for MP3 and OGG and major fixes were made for tagging other file formats.

It is also worth noting that RB V4.9 or 5.0 is planned to allow you to use more of the tags within PLG Pro including the Genre field and possibly others. Dmitry will be able to clarify this point.

Yes, there are plans to do it, hopefully Genre filtering will be added in the 4.9 version. Do you have any specific requests on how to use the Genre tag field?

 

[dave-t]

Hi Dmtry

Great news! - as you know Tag version have caused me issues and it is great that RB 4.9 has been re-worked to overcome these issues!

As far as the "Genre field is concerned it would be great to have an "include" AND an exclude" option so that PLG Pro could, for example, create a playlist of tracks between 1970 and 1979 with a "Genre" of Motown and NOT Xmas (from the "Comments" Tag).

OR

A playlist of track between 1970 and 1979 EXCLUDING the "genre" of Motown.

Having but Include and Exclue would provide very powerful flexibility.

One thing to note - I do not necessarily conform to "standard" Genres so this field really needs to be free flow text.

IF possible, it would be great for PLG Pro to also be able to to filter on "Rating" & "Gender" or better still, for PLGPro to be "weighted" towards the "rating field" eg Rating of 10 get a higher play repeat than those of a rating of 1.

Regards

Dave

 

[radiodungog]

Dave,

Is there an online resource that would allow us to update our comment fields with chart details ?  I realise there are US charts, UK charts and Australian charts ... but you know what I mean.

And I see on your website that your music collection includes all number ONE tracks from the charts.  Where did you get those from ?  Is there a commercially available music library that can provide such a collection ?

It seems another meta-tag could be very useful called "Charts" ...  hence leaving the "Comments" tag for our personal flags or comments.


Thanks, Jamie C.

 

[dave-t]

Hi Jamie

I do not know of any resource that can automatically tag files with chart info. the nearest there is TuneUpMedia www.tuneupmedia.com which will tag albums with release dates composers etc but it is not 100% accurate

Yes I have the entire UK No 1's from 1952 to last sunday ! I bought these - apart from the last few - from Mastermixdj.com but it is not cheap.

there are a variety of resources for DJ

www.mastermixdj.com
www.dmddownload.com
www.promoonly.com

Depending on where you are in the world you may be able to find other resources.

As for my Chart collection I purchased the entire UK charts from 1952 to 1962 via iTunes. After 1962 it has simply been a long hard flog of ripping CDs and my vast collection of vinyl. My father also has 15,000 CDs which I have yet to look at ! these contain music from the late 1930s to today.

Sorry no easy answer - it has taken me 10 months so far to create my library and I still have a long way to go !

Hope this helps

Dave

 

[radiodungog]

Dave,

Interesting stuff.  Are you on Facebook ?  Can I message you there and ask some questions about charts and stuff ?

Thanks, Jamie C.

 

[djsoft]

dave-t
I think we'll start with Genre filter like this:
[x ] Include tracks with specified genres
[  ] Exclude tracks with specified genres
(... genres list ...)

Another filters will be also added in 4.9. Weighted selection is a good idea. Probably this will be added too.

 

[dave-t]

Dave,

Interesting stuff.  Are you on Facebook ?  Can I message you there and ask some questions about charts and stuff ?

Thanks, Jamie C.

Hi Jamie

It depends what help you need?  My knowledge is limited and I use existing on line resources when I need them. Obviously my interest is the UK so have little knowledge about resources outside of this country.

Currently I am working hard to get my station online too so I may not be able to answer straight away.

No I am not on facebook personally although Radio 45 Gold does have a page. However that is there to talk about the station and promote it rather than anything else.

I am on twitter @radio45gold

Can you indicate what kind of help you require?

 

[dave-t]

dave-t
I think we'll start with Genre filter like this:
[x ] Include tracks with specified genres
[  ] Exclude tracks with specified genres
(... genres list ...)

Another filters will be also added in 4.9. Weighted selection is a good idea. Probably this will be added too.

That does look good to me  Hopefully we will be able to "include" and "Exclude" in the same filter process?

As I have NOT yet "rated" any tracks weighting is a little further down the road for me but others may want it sooner. Hopefully this feature will be added BUT needs to be "Optional" rather than by default.

Hopefully once you have sorted the Genre filtering it will be fairly easy to add others 

Looking forward to the beta testing 

 

[radiodungog]

David,

I wanted to compare notes and discuss tagging as well as offer some suggestions towards ripping CDs from our experience with Vortexbox and other things.

Simple things like:
1. Vortexbox is brilliant tool for ripping, storing and organising a CD music library.  It is perfect for ripping CDs instantly, small batches of CDs and storing your whole library.
2. For larger quantities like your dad's CD collection consider building another mass ripping box based on dBpoweramp with 8 x CD-ROM platters for the simultaneous ripping of 8 CDs ... with an expected throughput of at least 64 CDs per hour including the addition of artist, album, track, year, genre titles and tags.

We are putting this stuff together as a master document for our community radio station and probably putting it up on a Wiki so that future volunteers can see the technical path of progress.

But also I'd like to have a discussion about the most efficient and useful way of wording the comment tags so that they are easily dealt with by the filtering expressions and code that Dmitry has planned for RadioBOSS.  No point adding 4,000 comment codes to a library if the syntax is slightly wrong to be interpreted by the filtering logic.


Thanks, Jamie C.

 

[dave-t]

Hi Jamie

Pop along to my web site and complete the contact form. We can then discuss via e-mail.

 

[radiodungog]

David,

What about we open up another thread here and discuss it so other people can throw in suggestions too ?  This is an easy to use mechanism (not as easy as Facebook) and we might attract some very good discussion... and we will all benefit from using the suggestions in RadioBOSS.


Jamie C.

 

[dave-t]

Fine by me as long as the RB team don't mind ?

The "General Board" would be more appropriate